This is based on 2nd ed. So here goes:

With your 3 card, similarly to 4 card, you are usually trying to win the battle and do damage. Having that in mind:

1. Ser Loras Tyrell - many a Tyrell victory came thanks to Loras giving Tyrell additional attack before rest of the houses have chance to plan and put into motion a counter
2. Ser Gregor Clegane - 3 sword icons is the most direct damage you can do in the game and since you are looking to win battles with 3 card, damage is what you are going for. Only Blackfish can thwart him
3. Victarion Greyjoy - allows GJ to dominate the seas, which is crucial strategically
4. Renly Baratheon - his skill doesn't help you win the battle, but if you do win, ability to upgrade a footman to a knight is nothing to sneer at
5. Rob Stark - some will probably not agree with this low ranking, but while in theory being able to dictate where defeated enemy retreats could be huge, I haven't seen it make major difference too often, probably because north is relatively crammed and there are not many options to choose from
6. Areo Hotah - as already noted, with 3 card, you are looking to win, fortification can be useful if you miscalculate, but if you're playing well, it shouldn't come into play too often

Last edited by ajant on 2018-Apr-29 16:18, edited 1x in total

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I would put Victarion on 2, because if you dominate the sea you dominate the enemy and with him you are basically guaranteed to win at sea.
Robb above Renly, because though situational, his ability is more powerful than an upgraded footman

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AFFC PBF - #10
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I agree with Harakon.

Loras is undoubtfully the most dangerous card in the game due to his gamebreaking ability.
But Victarion comes very close to that, since its a garantueed attack via Sea.
Imagine any other house than GJ having this card, it owuld be HUGE.

Same for Robb, it still has some tactical use and can be very dangerous for overagressive enemies who suddenly find their units rereated in Starks Lands, while The Renly-upgrade is rarely happening.

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"Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." , Terry Pratchett

I agree putting Robb over Renly completely, but I go with Gregor on second position. Except for House Stark, the threat of Gregor is a strong psychological weapon, as well as the possibility to kill a whole army at once, basically crippling the enemy... Vic only works for attack and only on sea (or supported by). Although I agree it's a very strong card and well used it can be game breaking too, more than Gregor. Difficult to compare those 2.

i was seriously considering putting victarion 2nd, but in the end those 3 swords just look so damn awesome. u guys are probably right though, it's easier to get most out of victarion's ability then mountain's

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Agree that Ser Gregor is a man for all seasons, and that gives him the edge over Victarion.  The swords work on offense, defense, land and sea.  When I'm Bara, Patchface is normally removing the Mountain rather than Tywin.

Particularly in conjunction with the rest of Greyjoy's deck, they already have Balon as an overachiever in the raw combat strength, but the inability to inflict casualties with these most powerful cards makes up the biggest hole in their game.

Robb over Renly, for sure.  I've seen many an occupying Greyjoy force in Winterfell get routed to Castle Black and finished off by a weak-ass attack.

1. Loras
2. Gregor
3. Victarion
4. Robb
5. Areo
6. Renly

I give Areo the edge over Renly just barely, because Renly's ability just never seems to come into play as much as it seems like it should.  He's the only 3 that I regularly see people not worry about leaving as their last card before a redraw.

Renly is useful when Bara and Stark are allies and Stark wants to use Roose. Then Renly ensures a win and gives Bara an upgrade while Stark recycles cards. Win-Win. Plus with Davos, Bara gets another 3 card with a sword to make up for the loss. Very situational, and usually only in the early rounds as Bara will already have all five knights in the mid-game.

if we're judging him against the other 3 cards, I don't think it's fair to give Renly a higher rating because Davos makes up for his weakness.

No. I agree that Renly is the weakest of the 3-cards. I was just pointing out that his ability isn't completely useless. It's just mostly useless.

1. Loras
2. Victarion
3. Gregor Clegane
4. Robb Stark
5. Renly
6. Areo Hotah

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Premium - Loras, Victarion, Gregor
Loras: His ability shapes games, and is often one of the win conditions for house Tyrell. Being able to manipulate marches is great. He can be misused though, and I've seen people needlessly hold on to him. When you're fighting a defensive war, having Mace or QoT is actually more valuable.

Victarion: Victarion always goes ahead of Gregor for me. This card ensures sea supremacy, and is a tank buster on land and sea. The fact that this card, a 3 strength card, is often played as a 5 or 6 strength card should tell you all you need to know. People evaluate Stannis as good because of the conditional +1 strength. This card I would say is less conditional, and can provide +2-3 strength!

Gregor: Ensuring at least 2 casualties on all your direct neighbors on a high strength card - no more details required.

Good - Robb
Robb: His ability can be as devastating as Gregor sometimes, but other times it won't do anything, or is of limited use. I like using him, good card.

Meh - Renly, Areo
Renly: Ability to gain an additional mustering point in some situations is useful. I personally like the card design - conditional ability that can give you an edge. Most cases for me though, I play him as a 3 strength blank card.

Areo: Meh!

Last edited by Zsa on 2018-May-01 19:49, edited 1x in total

i'm going to change my mind a bit. i've noticed that there is very little hesitation in gj playing victarion. you know what his strength is and you know what to use him for. ser gregor on the other hand is kind of wasted if you play him against one footman for instance. often times he turns out to be very difficult to maximize, because people are saving him, hoping to get a chance to kill 3 units or 2 knights. that's a big handicap, when you are unable/unwilling to play your only 3 card

i'll change my ranking by moving victarion to 2nd spot and ser gregor to 3rd

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i'm going to change my mind a bit. i've noticed that there is very little hesitation in gj playing victarion. you know what his strength is and you know what to use him for. ser gregor on the other hand is kind of wasted if you play him against one footman for instance. often times he turns out to be very difficult to maximize, because people are saving him, hoping to get a chance to kill 3 units or 2 knights. that's a big handicap, when you are unable/unwilling to play your only 3 card

i'll change my ranking by moving victarion to 2nd spot and ser gregor to 3rd
I think there are a variety of reasons for people being more willing to play Victarion quickly, which don't necessarily make him stronger than Gregor.  Victarion can match or exceed Greyjoy's other big cards on offense, but his talents are wasted on defense (as opposed to Balon, Euron or Gregor himself).  So it makes sense that he would be Greyjoy's first choice to lead their attack, while holding back his more versatile brothers to more effectively manage counter-attacks.  And Greyjoy is almost always on the attack, cycling more quickly than anyone.

This is compounded by always being up against Roose (who means there's no point getting fancy with card selection because you're never going to catch Stark with his housecard pants down) or Tyrion (who forces you to play your big cards faster or risk not getting them back).  And because a Greyjoy with only his weak cards is very vulnerable indeed*, you can't risk playing a cycle without all three of your big guys.  The Lanni deck has so many more possibilities that it makes sense to play slow and keep all options open to set up the kind of big rope-a-dope counterattack combo you need to land to win.  Whereas Greyjoy's deck is such a blunt instrument that the only thing to do is keep relentlessly hammering away.



*Sidebar: Think about where each house stands if it spends all its big cards early.  This doesn't really happen to Stark, but even if Roose fails him, his low cards provide complete protection against Bara/GJ swords, so he may lose ground but not units if he has to rely on only them.  With Lanni, both Kevan and Tyrion can provide up to 5 effective combat str, and the Hound similarly provides complete protection against any Greyjoy swords.  Whereas Asha/Dagmer provide limited to no protection against Edd or Gregor, and make Cersei a more viable threat if they are the only ones home to defend.

my point is that it's very easy to utilize victarion's strength to the fullest, but not so with ser gregor. many times lannie needs strength 3 card to win a battle and while bara will play rennly and not think twice about it, lannie will hesitate, since he would be maybe wasting 3 swords on one footman or one ship. for me, a key thing in ranking cards is not just how useful it is, but how hard is it to maximize its strength. both ser gregor and victarion are very powerful cards, but victarion is much easier to maximize and thus for me, it's a better card

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My kung fu is the best

my point is that it's very easy to utilize victarion's strength to the fullest, but not so with ser gregor. many times lannie needs strength 3 card to win a battle and while bara will play rennly and not think twice about it, lannie will hesitate, since he would be maybe wasting 3 swords on one footman or one ship. for me, a key thing in ranking cards is not just how useful it is, but how hard is it to maximize its strength. both ser gregor and victarion are very powerful cards, but victarion is much easier to maximize and thus for me, it's a better card
IMO, that is a trick of perspective.  It's easier to max out Victarion's potential because his potential has a lower limit - winning exactly 1 battle.  Gregor's potential is hard to max because it is so high.  If you are hesitating to use Gregor, that is your own problem.  People could theoretically be hesitant to use Victarion when he is "just" a 4 str card, when he could be a 5-6.  That wouldn't be the card's fault, it'd be the player's.

And again, I don't think it's the strength of the card, but the board position and shape of the rest of the deck that dictates that Greyjoy is always trying to wear his opponent down with constant attacks, whereas Lanni is biding time for a big knockout blow.

And Greyjoy's strategy is so straightforward because none of its cards have the big, game-breaking capacity that other house decks have.  Gregor's swords are so copious that they are almost on par with QOT/Doran/Patchface/Cersei's abilities in terms of their ripple effects.

Last edited by Ser Hodor on 2018-May-30 16:05, edited 1x in total

It's easier to max out Victarion's potential because his potential has a lower limit - winning exactly 1 battle.  Gregor's potential is hard to max because it is so high.
there has to be a balance between potential and ease of use, for card to outrank other cards. blackfish would be one of the best cards in the game, were it easier to maximize it, but since stark fights gj and/or bara like at least 80% of the time, blackfish rarely serves as anything more then 1 tower card. were it matched up against garlan, gregor, mace or red viper more often, it would be much more useful. for me gregor's balance is not as good as victarion's

People could theoretically be hesitant to use Victarion when he is "just" a 4 str card, when he could be a 5-6.
first of all i don't think many people will hesitate to use victarion because he us just 4 strength card, if it wins them crucial combat, but even if it happens, it's extremely rare, compared to ser gregor, from my experience. this is exactly my point. ser gregor, and cersei are so hard to use, they often end up last 2 cards in lannie hand, meaning just one of them will be avalaible after hand is returned, that sucks

And Greyjoy's strategy is so straightforward because none of its cards have the big, game-breaking capacity that other house decks have.
i'd say that balon is to 3 game breaking card in the game

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